Comments on: The dumbness (and fearmongering) behind the new travel rules http://www.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/ Conversation. Collaboration. Community. Sat, 06 Mar 2010 02:35:30 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Traveler http://www.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/comment-page-1/#comment-899 Traveler Tue, 22 Aug 2006 06:02:57 +0000 http://dev.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/#comment-899 Well, I think it is really hard for us normal people to find out the whole truth. It may very well be that one of the greatest attacks was prevented just in time, but there has been suspiciously little evidence and a couple of things don't make much sense. Could be this is just because investigations are still ongoing. One thing is certain though. I will now <a title="Travel" href="http://www.opentravelinfo.com" rel="nofollow">travel</a> with much more discomfort than I ever did before and I am going to have an uneasy feeling about it until after landing. Well, I think it is really hard for us normal people to find out the whole truth. It may very well be that one of the greatest attacks was prevented just in time, but there has been suspiciously little evidence and a couple of things don’t make much sense.
Could be this is just because investigations are still ongoing.
One thing is certain though. I will now travel with much more discomfort than I ever did before and I am going to have an uneasy feeling about it until after landing.

]]> By: Tom Chiverton http://www.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/comment-page-1/#comment-898 Tom Chiverton Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:07:26 +0000 http://dev.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/#comment-898 wayne: Had a discussion about that on the train last week - I thought it may be better to just mix up something really flamable and set it off, rather than attempt to make an actual explosive which has a number of drawbacks. And, yes, the government has and is doing a great job of doing the terrorists job for them, causing major disruption to air travel. wayne: Had a discussion about that on the train last week – I thought it may be better to just mix up something really flamable and set it off, rather than attempt to make an actual explosive which has a number of drawbacks.

And, yes, the government has and is doing a great job of doing the terrorists job for them, causing major disruption to air travel.

]]> By: wayne mcfetridge http://www.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/comment-page-1/#comment-897 wayne mcfetridge Mon, 14 Aug 2006 04:38:42 +0000 http://dev.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/#comment-897 What I want to know/hear is discussion on whether this whole "liquid explosives mixed on plane" plot would actually have been very effective. I have a bit of a science background and it seems a little far fetched to think that it would have brought the plane down. No doubt there would have been some damage but if anyone watches Myth Busters they may have seen the episode in which the dispell the "Bullet hole in plane causes rapid decrompression and catastrophic structural failure" Those guys had to wire up with plastic explosives and rather large section of the plane's fuselage to get any kind of catastrophic structural failure. It anoys me that there is just no rational talk of the feasibilty of pulling off this kind of attack. I guess that's why its called terrorism - causing wide spread "terror" is really the ultimate goal if you get to blow up a few of your enemies in the process well... What I want to know/hear is discussion on whether this whole “liquid explosives mixed on plane” plot would actually have been very effective. I have a bit of a science background and it seems a little far fetched to think that it would have brought the plane down.

No doubt there would have been some damage but if anyone watches Myth Busters they may have seen the episode in which the dispell the “Bullet hole in plane causes rapid decrompression and catastrophic structural failure” Those guys had to wire up with plastic explosives and rather large section of the plane’s fuselage to get any kind of catastrophic structural failure.

It anoys me that there is just no rational talk of the feasibilty of pulling off this kind of attack.

I guess that’s why its called terrorism – causing wide spread “terror” is really the ultimate goal if you get to blow up a few of your enemies in the process well…

]]> By: trib http://www.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/comment-page-1/#comment-896 trib Mon, 14 Aug 2006 03:11:53 +0000 http://dev.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/#comment-896 George (why not your real email and URL?), what I see is an overreaching, oversimplified, overly intrusive attempt by many Western governments to protect "us" from a threat that isn't nearly as prevalent as they would have us believe. The intrusions, growing limitations and changes to our freedoms are a massive overreaction to the threat. And yes, I'm already familiar with CALEA and Echelon. That's why I'm a life member of <a href="www.efa.org.au" rel="nofollow">Electronic Frontiers Australia</a> and a member of the <a href="www.eff.org" rel="nofollow">EFF</a>. George (why not your real email and URL?), what I see is an overreaching, oversimplified, overly intrusive attempt by many Western governments to protect “us” from a threat that isn’t nearly as prevalent as they would have us believe.

The intrusions, growing limitations and changes to our freedoms are a massive overreaction to the threat.

And yes, I’m already familiar with CALEA and Echelon. That’s why I’m a life member of Electronic Frontiers Australia and a member of the EFF.

]]> By: George http://www.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/comment-page-1/#comment-892 George Mon, 14 Aug 2006 02:48:55 +0000 http://dev.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/#comment-892 The fearmongering you perceive is the feedback from a desperate widereaching attempt to make sure that something surpassing 911 in horror was stopped. As far as 1984 is concerned, just how much reality do you really want with that? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communications_Assistance_for_Law_Enforcement_Act also look up eschelon if youre into that kind of thing. The fearmongering you perceive is the feedback from a desperate widereaching attempt to make sure that something surpassing 911 in horror was stopped.

As far as 1984 is concerned, just how much reality do you really want with that?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communications_Assistance_for_Law_Enforcement_Act
also look up eschelon if youre into that kind of thing.

]]> By: ericd http://www.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/comment-page-1/#comment-895 ericd Mon, 14 Aug 2006 00:15:22 +0000 http://dev.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/#comment-895 You can call the potential risk of the attack small. Because people were doing their jobs well. Imagine if just a few people failed to communicate or do their job properly. It would have been a much different story. Again, I see people feeling much more safe in the face of terrorism. We are stopping them all over the world, not completely, but at a far greater clip than previously. I don't see any correlation with 1984 there at all. Someone saying we shouldn't forget 9-11 or what cowardly terrorists are capable is fine logic to me. We get complacent when we prevent their acts from taking place. I guess we can simply agree to disagree. Ooops... the batteries have run out on my FrontRow remote control, I'll blame Blair for that one, I'll give GWB a pass on that one, for now. You can call the potential risk of the attack small. Because people were doing their jobs well. Imagine if just a few people failed to communicate or do their job properly. It would have been a much different story.

Again, I see people feeling much more safe in the face of terrorism. We are stopping them all over the world, not completely, but at a far greater clip than previously. I don’t see any correlation with 1984 there at all.

Someone saying we shouldn’t forget 9-11 or what cowardly terrorists are capable is fine logic to me. We get complacent when we prevent their acts from taking place.

I guess we can simply agree to disagree.

Ooops… the batteries have run out on my FrontRow remote control, I’ll blame Blair for that one, I’ll give GWB a pass on that one, for now.

]]> By: trib http://www.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/comment-page-1/#comment-894 trib Mon, 14 Aug 2006 00:04:12 +0000 http://dev.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/#comment-894 [quote comment="8345"]I don't see or feel fear mongering. I see that a large-scale terrorist act was stopped before it was carried out. I feel far safer now :) In other news, my toothbrush has worn out... and I am blaming the Bush Administration.[/quote] Eric, I too see this. But it's the context in which the thwarting of that act took place. The alleged terrorists were deeply infiltrated, and had been for weeks; the risk of the potential attack which has prompted the latest series of changes to carry-on rules was small. The reaction of the security infrastructure, media and the airlines is overblown. The politicians have arguably made their announcements to leverage advantage for themselves (but there's always two sides to that argument). It's that sort of thing that annoys me in this whole New World Order of the need to live in fear. It smacks too much of an approaching <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nineteen_Eighty-Four" rel="nofollow">1984</a> and <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V_for_vendetta" rel="nofollow">V for Vendetta</a> world for my liking. [quote comment="8345"]I don’t see or feel fear mongering. I see that a large-scale terrorist act was stopped before it was carried out. I feel far safer now :)

In other news, my toothbrush has worn out… and I am blaming the Bush Administration.[/quote]

Eric, I too see this. But it’s the context in which the thwarting of that act took place. The alleged terrorists were deeply infiltrated, and had been for weeks; the risk of the potential attack which has prompted the latest series of changes to carry-on rules was small. The reaction of the security infrastructure, media and the airlines is overblown. The politicians have arguably made their announcements to leverage advantage for themselves (but there’s always two sides to that argument).

It’s that sort of thing that annoys me in this whole New World Order of the need to live in fear. It smacks too much of an approaching 1984 and V for Vendetta world for my liking.

]]> By: ericd http://www.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/comment-page-1/#comment-893 ericd Sun, 13 Aug 2006 23:54:00 +0000 http://dev.acidlabs.org/2006/08/14/the-dumbness-and-fearmongering-behind-the-new-travel-rules/#comment-893 I don't see or feel fear mongering. I see that a large-scale terrorist act was stopped before it was carried out. I feel far safer now :) In other news, my toothbrush has worn out... and I am blaming the Bush Administration. I don’t see or feel fear mongering. I see that a large-scale terrorist act was stopped before it was carried out. I feel far safer now :)

In other news, my toothbrush has worn out… and I am blaming the Bush Administration.

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